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	<title>Comments on: Why Are We Still Using Internet Explorer 6?</title>
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	<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/</link>
	<description>Life - Technology</description>
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		<title>By: Etienne Levesque Guitard</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-41</link>
		<dc:creator>Etienne Levesque Guitard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Mar 2011 18:40:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-41</guid>
		<description>Enterprise requirements huh. I think the problem lies within the way these things are done. Period.

Having to comply with 600 rules and having methodologies that make this whole evolution process is not the problem, it&#039;s the methodologies themselves which are.

There is a fundamental problem in an enterprise or government&#039;s workflow when it takes years to upgrade software. That&#039;s hampering productivity and progress.

Not seeing there&#039;s an easy solution, but there&#039;s definitely something to be done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Enterprise requirements huh. I think the problem lies within the way these things are done. Period.</p>
<p>Having to comply with 600 rules and having methodologies that make this whole evolution process is not the problem, it&#8217;s the methodologies themselves which are.</p>
<p>There is a fundamental problem in an enterprise or government&#8217;s workflow when it takes years to upgrade software. That&#8217;s hampering productivity and progress.</p>
<p>Not seeing there&#8217;s an easy solution, but there&#8217;s definitely something to be done.</p>
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		<title>By: Wei Ke</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-8</link>
		<dc:creator>Wei Ke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Nov 2010 17:05:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-8</guid>
		<description>If only I read this article earlier. 

Recently for the sake of learning WCF I downloaded IE 7. Only found it didn&#039;t work for the application I worked on, which only worked with IE6. Then I had to remove IE 6, only found IE 6 didn&#039;t work as well. It costs much ado to get my pc work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If only I read this article earlier. </p>
<p>Recently for the sake of learning WCF I downloaded IE 7. Only found it didn&#8217;t work for the application I worked on, which only worked with IE6. Then I had to remove IE 6, only found IE 6 didn&#8217;t work as well. It costs much ado to get my pc work.</p>
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		<title>By: annoyed</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-6</link>
		<dc:creator>annoyed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Nov 2010 01:20:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-6</guid>
		<description>@David @Ian Yep, and when we buy hardware we have to make sure it works with Windows XP. When we buy hard drives they have to be compatible with our SAN storage (or you end up with 285 applications, some mission critical, down for 12 hours after an upgrade). And when you buy network switches you have to make sure they&#039;re compatible with the routers/firewalls/load-balancers, SSL acceleration appliances (15 hours), etc. Welcome to the realities of enterprise IT.

The situation is in no way ideal. There are costs associated with both moving forward and keeping the status quo. I am definitely not arguing that. I am simply pointing out the IT side of the question, as there are plenty of end-users out there arguing their perspective. My department has decided that blocking half the Internet is a less costly security approach than upgrading to a newer browser if that newer browser means HR can&#039;t process 25,000 employees paychecks because the pay application doesn&#039;t work outside IE6. Really, you want access to Facebook or your paycheck? I mean, how F&#039;ed up is that?

My department spends about 80% of its IT budget just &quot;keeping the lights on&quot;, as we say. Only 20% of our budget can be used to move forward (upgrades, enhancements, etc). And it isn&#039;t IT that gets to decide where that 20% goes. We get our marching orders from the program areas. Our IT systems are ridiculously out of date. We know it. And now thanks to the Auditor General many more people know it too. The AG&#039;s report is finally getting us some money to do something about it.

Regarding having two browsers, personally I agree (in fact I do have both IE6 and Firefox, officially installed). But I am going to try to dig up the statistics about how much helpdesk calls dropped when we went from two browsers to one. It was significant. Downright scary in fact to see find out just how many people apparently were unable to close one browser and open the other if a site didn&#039;t work properly. Perhaps our workforce is more computer literate 7 years later... I don&#039;t know.

We support 200 applications developed in-house and some 2000 commercial software products. What&#039;s one more browser. And we should also support Open Office too. And people who want to use an Apple, and another 50+ applications for that. Oh, and I want to carry an IPhone rather than a BlackBerry. And why doesn&#039;t my IPad work on the network?

Tell your Minister to stop passing legislation that requires changes to IT systems, and tell them to instead direct that 20% to upgrading the applications that are holding IE6 around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@David @Ian Yep, and when we buy hardware we have to make sure it works with Windows XP. When we buy hard drives they have to be compatible with our SAN storage (or you end up with 285 applications, some mission critical, down for 12 hours after an upgrade). And when you buy network switches you have to make sure they&#8217;re compatible with the routers/firewalls/load-balancers, SSL acceleration appliances (15 hours), etc. Welcome to the realities of enterprise IT.</p>
<p>The situation is in no way ideal. There are costs associated with both moving forward and keeping the status quo. I am definitely not arguing that. I am simply pointing out the IT side of the question, as there are plenty of end-users out there arguing their perspective. My department has decided that blocking half the Internet is a less costly security approach than upgrading to a newer browser if that newer browser means HR can&#8217;t process 25,000 employees paychecks because the pay application doesn&#8217;t work outside IE6. Really, you want access to Facebook or your paycheck? I mean, how F&#8217;ed up is that?</p>
<p>My department spends about 80% of its IT budget just &#8220;keeping the lights on&#8221;, as we say. Only 20% of our budget can be used to move forward (upgrades, enhancements, etc). And it isn&#8217;t IT that gets to decide where that 20% goes. We get our marching orders from the program areas. Our IT systems are ridiculously out of date. We know it. And now thanks to the Auditor General many more people know it too. The AG&#8217;s report is finally getting us some money to do something about it.</p>
<p>Regarding having two browsers, personally I agree (in fact I do have both IE6 and Firefox, officially installed). But I am going to try to dig up the statistics about how much helpdesk calls dropped when we went from two browsers to one. It was significant. Downright scary in fact to see find out just how many people apparently were unable to close one browser and open the other if a site didn&#8217;t work properly. Perhaps our workforce is more computer literate 7 years later&#8230; I don&#8217;t know.</p>
<p>We support 200 applications developed in-house and some 2000 commercial software products. What&#8217;s one more browser. And we should also support Open Office too. And people who want to use an Apple, and another 50+ applications for that. Oh, and I want to carry an IPhone rather than a BlackBerry. And why doesn&#8217;t my IPad work on the network?</p>
<p>Tell your Minister to stop passing legislation that requires changes to IT systems, and tell them to instead direct that 20% to upgrading the applications that are holding IE6 around.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-5</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Nov 2010 00:20:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-5</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the article Christopher — I do, however, feel obligated to dispute any reasoning which claims that upgrades are not put in place because of &quot;costs&quot; associated with upgrading legacy systems. I feel particularly obliged to dispute this point when the employer in question happens to be government.

I&#039;m curious if any consideration to the hidden costs associated with failing to upgrade legacy systems, supporting deprecated technology, or the security risks IE6 continually exposes employees to. What about the damage the organization inadvertently contributes to by leaving hundreds of thousands of IE6 referer stamps in server logs around the world? (With enough people visiting a site with IE6, that site will likely feel obliged to continue to support IE6 out of necessity, thus holding back their own site&#039;s evolution and that of the internet overall.) I guarantee you that if the current IT landscape which you have illustrated is going to become a lot more costly and problematic as it is continually ignored.

Like @patlaj and @David have suggested, users should have alternate browsers choices available to them. Even Firefox with IETab installed would make a major difference in terms of security and overall web experience and the costs of doing so would be minimal. Contributing towards positive change with measurable results does not need to cost millions…</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the article Christopher — I do, however, feel obligated to dispute any reasoning which claims that upgrades are not put in place because of &#8220;costs&#8221; associated with upgrading legacy systems. I feel particularly obliged to dispute this point when the employer in question happens to be government.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m curious if any consideration to the hidden costs associated with failing to upgrade legacy systems, supporting deprecated technology, or the security risks IE6 continually exposes employees to. What about the damage the organization inadvertently contributes to by leaving hundreds of thousands of IE6 referer stamps in server logs around the world? (With enough people visiting a site with IE6, that site will likely feel obliged to continue to support IE6 out of necessity, thus holding back their own site&#8217;s evolution and that of the internet overall.) I guarantee you that if the current IT landscape which you have illustrated is going to become a lot more costly and problematic as it is continually ignored.</p>
<p>Like @patlaj and @David have suggested, users should have alternate browsers choices available to them. Even Firefox with IETab installed would make a major difference in terms of security and overall web experience and the costs of doing so would be minimal. Contributing towards positive change with measurable results does not need to cost millions…</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-3</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Nov 2010 19:57:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-3</guid>
		<description>Of course, what you have there is a self-perpetuating situation. With only one web browser (IE6), even when you upgrade your software, you have to make sure that your upgrade works with IE6. When you procure new software, you write into new RFPs that the software works with IE6, which limits the responses and may prevent some good software that otherwise might be successful from competing. And you never have the opportunity to break out of the cycle.

It may be time for a second look at the &quot;one enterprise browser&quot; policy. Yes, there are additional costs (if not in licenses, in effort to maintain and support). But two browsers gives you a path forward out of the trap. You can keep IE6 for legacy applications and also have available a modern, standards-compliant browser to enable new, improved software and other productivity increases from browser improvements. Over time, as legacy applications get upgraded or replaced, the need to hold on to IE6 will diminish and eventually disappear. In the meantime, you can benefit from the full range of sites and software on the market - not just the ones that work with IE6. 

Those benefits may very well add up to more than the cost of adding another browser.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, what you have there is a self-perpetuating situation. With only one web browser (IE6), even when you upgrade your software, you have to make sure that your upgrade works with IE6. When you procure new software, you write into new RFPs that the software works with IE6, which limits the responses and may prevent some good software that otherwise might be successful from competing. And you never have the opportunity to break out of the cycle.</p>
<p>It may be time for a second look at the &#8220;one enterprise browser&#8221; policy. Yes, there are additional costs (if not in licenses, in effort to maintain and support). But two browsers gives you a path forward out of the trap. You can keep IE6 for legacy applications and also have available a modern, standards-compliant browser to enable new, improved software and other productivity increases from browser improvements. Over time, as legacy applications get upgraded or replaced, the need to hold on to IE6 will diminish and eventually disappear. In the meantime, you can benefit from the full range of sites and software on the market &#8211; not just the ones that work with IE6. </p>
<p>Those benefits may very well add up to more than the cost of adding another browser.</p>
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		<title>By: patlaj</title>
		<link>http://annoyed.ca/2009/07/27/why-are-we-still-using-internet-explorer-6/comment-page-1/#comment-2</link>
		<dc:creator>patlaj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 02:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://annoyed.ca/?p=442#comment-2</guid>
		<description>Great post, Christopher - it&#039;s great for people to be able to see the other side of the story, and you laid it out very clearly. 

I think a lot of people don&#039;t give a thought to their browser - IE6 works well enough for them. And for those that do care, Firefox can be installed alongside IE6. So workers can use Firefox for whatever they normally use their browser for, and switch to IE6 whenever they need to book leave (or whatever internal app requires that browser). No need for IE7 or 8 at all, but you get all the benefits of modern software.

I think the problem is that you might have to be a fairly sophisticated user in order to use two browsers like this. Maybe those who would make the request are also those sophisticated enough to be able to handle it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post, Christopher &#8211; it&#8217;s great for people to be able to see the other side of the story, and you laid it out very clearly. </p>
<p>I think a lot of people don&#8217;t give a thought to their browser &#8211; IE6 works well enough for them. And for those that do care, Firefox can be installed alongside IE6. So workers can use Firefox for whatever they normally use their browser for, and switch to IE6 whenever they need to book leave (or whatever internal app requires that browser). No need for IE7 or 8 at all, but you get all the benefits of modern software.</p>
<p>I think the problem is that you might have to be a fairly sophisticated user in order to use two browsers like this. Maybe those who would make the request are also those sophisticated enough to be able to handle it?</p>
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